Question About Terminator/T2

Masked Terror #1 · Post by **Masked Terror #1** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:47 pm

I know it's retarded to try and make sense of time travel logic, but after seeing the new one (not as good as anyone wanted, not as bad as some are saying), the following question occurred to me-

In Terminator, Arnold goes back in time to kill Sarah Connor before John can be born. Reese goes back to stop Arnie/save Sarah and inadvertently winds up becoming John's father. All of that kind of make sense so far.

In T2 it's revealed that after they crushed Arnie in that giant press, scientists got ahold of his arm. And that they used the futuristic technology they found there to develop what would eventually become Skynet. In a sense, Skynet gives birth to itself, which doesn't fully make sense (where/when was the Skynet technology actually developed?), but put that aside for a moment.

In T2, Sarah and John become aware that this is how Skynet was developed. So they (and the future resistance) know that no Arnie back in time equals no Skynet and it's already been established that altering the past alters the future, so why not just kill John Connor?

No John Connor, no Arnie back in time to kill Mom, no arm left behind, no Skynet?

WTF, James Cameron?

drizzle · Post by **drizzle** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 1:01 pm

well if they just kill john connor there's no summer movie to rake in mountains of gold for james cameron to rest his huge cock on

Trademark · Post by **Trademark** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 1:08 pm

drizzle wrote:well if they just kill john connor there's no summer movie to rake in mountains of gold for james cameron to rest his huge cock on

there is that...and then what if come to find out, arnie was sent back by john connor to kill john connor and this is just some huge time traveling circle jerk????? You know, it just keeps happening and happening through every wrinkle in time. Maybe reese was actually sent back to become John's dad.....Or how about John just kill reese????

Masked Terror #1 · Post by **Masked Terror #1** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 1:10 pm

Would have been an ill twist if right after that scientist dude explained the whole arm connection, Linda Hamilton has immediately shot Eddie Furlong in the head and been all, "Sorry Son, just saving the human race and all."

drizzle · Post by **drizzle** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 1:14 pm

^^ that kinda thing only happens in asian movies these days

Spartan · Post by **Spartan** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 2:20 pm

According to my dumb logic. Machines were losing the war despite taking mankind to the brink of extinction. So if Skynet didn't send a Terminator back to 1984, no Reece would follow and have hotel sex with Sarah the tart. Ginger doesn't die and her pet iguana stays well fed.

YouTube · Post by **Philaflava** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 2:28 pm

McG should only be allowed direct Sugar Ray music videos.

still illiterate · Post by **still illiterate** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 2:29 pm

you don't get it, john was already dead, smokey was trying trying to trick the terminator into killing him.

Trademark · Post by **Trademark** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 2:53 pm

Spartan wrote:According to my dumb logic. Machines were losing the war despite taking mankind to the brink of extinction. So if Skynet didn't send a Terminator back to 1984, no Reece would follow and have hotel sex with Sarah the tart. Ginger doesn't die and her pet iguana stays well fed.

very nice.

Masked Terror #1 · Post by **Masked Terror #1** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 3:15 pm

Skynet made all the logical decisions based on the info it had at the time. It probably didn't know Reece was the father until it sent Arnold back and he followed. Then, when it realized the deal, it put him on the top of the hitlist so they could kill him before that happened (in the new one).

What doesn't make sense is resistance not realizing that it is worth sacrificing John Conner before he becomes a big enough threat to Skynet that it sends a Terminator back through time to prevent his birth and accidentally (?) trigger its own birth.

bent · Post by **bent** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:05 pm

I haven't seen the new one. But in T1 Reece says he's from one possible future. Which changes everything rele.

But in T3, the future was set in stone (despite Sarah's motto).

I don't remember where I was going with this. Somebody who's not hungover and/or high please finish that thought for me.

Trademark · Post by **Trademark** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:26 pm

Bent what you said makes no sense, what masked terror says makes absolute perfect sense. Shoot John connor in the mouth right now and Skynet never sends arnold back to kill sarah connor meaning reese never goes meaning skynet never gets the technology to build the machines...

bent · Post by **bent** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:46 pm

Trademark wrote:Bent what you said makes no sense

Yeah, sorry about that.

But if we assume that the logic used in T3 is true. There never was any chance of stopping skynet/the war. The future was written in stone, which means there was never an option for anybody to kill John Connor.

as that would create a time paradox that might destroy the universe!!!

Which would be pretty heavy.

chapter thrive · Post by **chapter thrive** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 5:09 pm

again.
only an arguament between linear and multibranch time.

you just have to decide which paradigm sandbox youre playing in.

ANUBIS5 · Post by **ANUBIS5** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 7:18 am

I wonder if Ginger still has killer legs these days.

Nuke · Post by **Nuke** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 1:57 pm

I recall a South Park episode where they discuss movie 'time travel' rules like Back To The Future, and if my memory serves me correct, someone mentions 'Terminator' time travel rules which... 'don't make any sense.'

I was trying to find the clip, but I was unsuccesful. Maybe someone else remembers this. It may not have been in South Park, but I'm pretty sure it was a cartoon.

Truth. · Post by **Truth.** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 2:07 pm

ya damn it, why did sarah have to be pro-life?

Fuckin' A · Post by **Fuckin' A** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 3:46 pm

I was just thinking about this a couple of weeks ago when I was reading about time travel. The first two films seem to follow the predestination paradox

Because of the possibility of influencing the past while time traveling, one way of explaining why history does not change is by saying that whatever has happened must happen. A time traveler attempting to alter the past in this model, intentionally or not, would only be fulfilling their role in creating history as we know it, not changing it.

In the Terminator films, Skynet, a computer program that controls nearly the whole world in the future, sends a machine to the past in order to kill John Connor, the future leader of the human resistance, at different points of his life: once before he is conceived (by killing his mother, Sarah Connor), again when he is 14 years old (in Terminator 2: Judgment Day) and a final time a few days before Judgment Day happens (Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines). In the second movie Dr. Dyson (Joe Morton), the lead scientist for the Skynet project, explains that the surviving arm (used to strangle Sarah Connor near the end of the first movie) and CPU chip of the original Terminator was analyzed and found that the technology was so advanced, they (humans) would have never invented the technology themselves and was used to create Skynet in the first place. In the final movie, the humans, who have successfully invaded the complex in which the time machine is placed and have finally defeated the machines, always manage to send someone else to the past so that the Connors can be protected, which is what starts the series. In The Terminator, the machines send the T-101 and the humans send Kyle Reese: the first will give the people in the past the necessary components that will end up starting the Skynet project, and Kyle will be John Connor's father (that is, if the time travel hadn't happened then Skynet wouldn't have been created and John Connor wouldn't have been born).

meh, probably not worth trying to figure out hollywood logic.

Walter Sobchak · Post by **Walter Sobchak** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 5:49 pm

i don't think the arm birthed skynet. at least not from what i've seen/read. i think it just sped up the creation of skynet.

also, from what i've reasoned out Reese wasn't John's original father either. all the time traveling has altered parts of the past but certain things have still played out the same such as john becoming the leader of the resistance whether reese was his father or his mother was attacked by arnie.

Combo7 · Post by **Combo7** » Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:46 am

Masked Terror #1 wrote:In Terminator, Arnold goes back in time to kill Sarah Connor before John can be born. Reese goes back to stop Arnie/save Sarah and inadvertently winds up becoming John's father. All of that kind of make sense so far.

This makes no sense whatsoever.

Trademark · Post by **Trademark** » Mon Jun 08, 2009 1:10 pm

Combo7 wrote:
Masked Terror #1 wrote:In Terminator, Arnold goes back in time to kill Sarah Connor before John can be born. Reese goes back to stop Arnie/save Sarah and inadvertently winds up becoming John's father. All of that kind of make sense so far.

This makes no sense whatsoever.

Spartan · Post by **Spartan** » Mon Jun 08, 2009 1:23 pm

Trademark wrote:
Combo7 wrote:
Masked Terror #1 wrote:In Terminator, Arnold goes back in time to kill Sarah Connor before John can be born. Reese goes back to stop Arnie/save Sarah and inadvertently winds up becoming John's father. All of that kind of make sense so far.

This makes no sense whatsoever.

Question About Terminator/T2

Question About Terminator/T2

Re: Question About Terminator/T2

Re: Question About Terminator/T2

Re: Question About Terminator/T2